Discussion:
Taylor vs. Cheap Yamaha - am I crazy?
(too old to reply)
John Robinson
2003-08-18 11:42:30 UTC
Permalink
I have an Yamaha FG - paid £140 for it and have yet to play a Martin or a
Taylor which comes close to it.

On the other hand I have played a few Yamahas which also don't come close to
it! I think with a mass produced factory guitar you can get lucky or
unlucky with the materials - and it is this which makes the difference.

The only guitars I have played which I can say are significatnly better than
my "lucky" Yamaha are by Andy Manson, an outstanding luithier based in
Devon. My partner has two as main gigging/recording guitars and they are
superb. I even get to borrow one! And I will own one someday!!

Cheers
John Robinson
http://www.JulieEllison.co.uk
Hi all, first post here...
I still have my first guitar from about 5 years ago, an acoustic Yamaha
FG-411 solid top. However, recently I picked up a Taylor 410 from eBay.
After having had it for about 6 months I realise I much prefer the Yamaha
in
terms of pretty much everything apart from looks. I like the sound and
feel
of the Yamaha a whole lot more, the Taylor sounds dull and empty in
comparison. Have I gone insane? It seems strange that a ~£150 cheapo
Yamaha
could appeal so much more than a ~£1200 or whatever Taylor! Anyone else
had
similar situations I'd be interested to hear about them!
Cheers,
Dan
J A Sims
2003-08-18 14:12:46 UTC
Permalink
Now you are talking, "Larrivee", absolutely fantastic, they
had three arrive one morning at the shop in Westbury, I
played all three of them, all great but one was special and
of course a bit later on in the day someone bought it.
Some months later I saw it up on trade-it for 450 quid :-))

Julian Le Second

ps anyone got a private jet flying to Canada and then setting
back down near Bradford on Avon ;-))
Funny you should mention that, cos I have spotted this too.
A friend and meself went to the opening of a guitar shop in
Kings Lynn not too long ago where there were rows of new
Taylors, Larivee, Takamine etc etc and a few old Martins as
well. I'm a big fan of Leo Kottke, who uses Taylors so I was
well up for having a play on some of the higher end Taylors.
Quick bit of background info - my current guitar was
handbuilt by my old woodwork teacher and sings like a bird.
So, the upshot was that I played every Taylor in the house
and wouldn't have given you £400 for one let alone the £1400
asking price. Dull, flat and lifeless.
There was a 1972 Martin Dread that sounded amazing, couldn't
belive the tone, warmth, volume etc etc.
<rantmode>
Acoustic guitars are no longer made as pure 'acoustic'
instruments. They are made to be played amplified which has
got to affect the way in which they are constructed and
their sound when played unplugged, I rest my case. If you
want a real acoustic instrument and are looking in the high
end range, forget it, go get one made...
</rantmode off>
: I have an Yamaha FG - paid £140 for it and have yet to
play a Martin or a
: Taylor which comes close to it.
: On the other hand I have played a few Yamahas which also
don't come close to
: it! I think with a mass produced factory guitar you can
get lucky or
: unlucky with the materials - and it is this which makes
the difference.
: The only guitars I have played which I can say are
significatnly better than
: my "lucky" Yamaha are by Andy Manson, an outstanding
luithier based in
: Devon. My partner has two as main gigging/recording
guitars and they are
: superb. I even get to borrow one! And I will own one
someday!!
: Cheers
: John Robinson
: http://www.JulieEllison.co.uk
: > Hi all, first post here...
: >
: > I still have my first guitar from about 5 years ago, an
acoustic Yamaha
: > FG-411 solid top. However, recently I picked up a Taylor
410 from eBay.
: > After having had it for about 6 months I realise I much
prefer the Yamaha
: in
: > terms of pretty much everything apart from looks. I like
the sound and
: feel
: > of the Yamaha a whole lot more, the Taylor sounds dull
and empty in
: > comparison. Have I gone insane? It seems strange that a
~£150 cheapo
: Yamaha
: > could appeal so much more than a ~£1200 or whatever
Taylor! Anyone else
: had
: > similar situations I'd be interested to hear about them!
: >
: > Cheers,
: > Dan
: >
: >
--
Junior Mctavish Allstars
~~~
2pods
2003-08-18 20:34:36 UTC
Permalink
Lowden.
Get 'em while you can
Post by J A Sims
Now you are talking, "Larrivee", absolutely fantastic, they
had three arrive one morning at the shop in Westbury, I
played all three of them, all great but one was special and
of course a bit later on in the day someone bought it.
Some months later I saw it up on trade-it for 450 quid :-))
Julian Le Second
ps anyone got a private jet flying to Canada and then setting
back down near Bradford on Avon ;-))
Funny you should mention that, cos I have spotted this too.
A friend and meself went to the opening of a guitar shop in
Kings Lynn not too long ago where there were rows of new
Taylors, Larivee, Takamine etc etc and a few old Martins as
well. I'm a big fan of Leo Kottke, who uses Taylors so I was
well up for having a play on some of the higher end Taylors.
Quick bit of background info - my current guitar was
handbuilt by my old woodwork teacher and sings like a bird.
So, the upshot was that I played every Taylor in the house
and wouldn't have given you £400 for one let alone the £1400
asking price. Dull, flat and lifeless.
There was a 1972 Martin Dread that sounded amazing, couldn't
belive the tone, warmth, volume etc etc.
<rantmode>
Acoustic guitars are no longer made as pure 'acoustic'
instruments. They are made to be played amplified which has
got to affect the way in which they are constructed and
their sound when played unplugged, I rest my case. If you
want a real acoustic instrument and are looking in the high
end range, forget it, go get one made...
</rantmode off>
: I have an Yamaha FG - paid £140 for it and have yet to
play a Martin or a
: Taylor which comes close to it.
: On the other hand I have played a few Yamahas which also
don't come close to
: it! I think with a mass produced factory guitar you can
get lucky or
: unlucky with the materials - and it is this which makes
the difference.
: The only guitars I have played which I can say are
significatnly better than
: my "lucky" Yamaha are by Andy Manson, an outstanding
luithier based in
: Devon. My partner has two as main gigging/recording
guitars and they are
: superb. I even get to borrow one! And I will own one
someday!!
: Cheers
: John Robinson
: http://www.JulieEllison.co.uk
: > Hi all, first post here...
: >
: > I still have my first guitar from about 5 years ago, an
acoustic Yamaha
: > FG-411 solid top. However, recently I picked up a Taylor
410 from eBay.
: > After having had it for about 6 months I realise I much
prefer the Yamaha
: in
: > terms of pretty much everything apart from looks. I like
the sound and
: feel
: > of the Yamaha a whole lot more, the Taylor sounds dull
and empty in
: > comparison. Have I gone insane? It seems strange that a
~£150 cheapo
: Yamaha
: > could appeal so much more than a ~£1200 or whatever
Taylor! Anyone else
: had
: > similar situations I'd be interested to hear about them!
: >
: > Cheers,
: > Dan
: >
: >
--
Junior Mctavish Allstars
~~~
Magnus Paterson
2003-08-18 21:25:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by 2pods
Lowden.
Get 'em while you can
Yeah, grand if you can get George to make you one with a decent
neck profile. Apart from that, I'm not a huge fan.

Back up the thread, someone was enthusing about Yamaha. Fantastic
necks on some, very playable. Not the best amplified sound with
the onboard electrics if you're a purist, but damn fine guitars
for the money.

For me, the Rob Armstrong with EMG electrics beats anything
I've played. Two Olsons have been better acoustically (but I
can't afford $8k) and I played a nice Goodall with, I think,
a Fishman setup and that sang thru' the PA, but overall I'm
content with what I have.

Incidentally, it was regular contributor David Kilpatrick who
put me on to the Armstrong, and he also just sold me a superb
tenor mandola. DK has, I think, 2 Lowdens; one steel, one
nylon, and he's also posted comments on some groups (UKMG?
RMMGA?) about Lowdens, George Lowdens, and the current
factory derivatives of the Lowden range. DAVID!! YOU OUT
THERE??

Cheers,
Magnus
John Robinson
2003-08-18 21:47:16 UTC
Permalink
Played a few Lowdens. None really "spoke to me" and none struck me as being
especialy playable but for one, which was sold by the time I went back for a
re-try.

The shop owner told me that this was his last stock and the original "Mr
Lowden" was withdrawing his name from the factory guitars which carry the
name. Is this due to quality problems? Is the original Mr Lowden (who I
assume is the George referred to in the previous postings) going to build
them himself in future?

John Robinson
http://www.JulieEllison.co.uk
Post by Magnus Paterson
Post by 2pods
Lowden.
Get 'em while you can
Yeah, grand if you can get George to make you one with a decent
neck profile. Apart from that, I'm not a huge fan.
Back up the thread, someone was enthusing about Yamaha. Fantastic
necks on some, very playable. Not the best amplified sound with
the onboard electrics if you're a purist, but damn fine guitars
for the money.
For me, the Rob Armstrong with EMG electrics beats anything
I've played. Two Olsons have been better acoustically (but I
can't afford $8k) and I played a nice Goodall with, I think,
a Fishman setup and that sang thru' the PA, but overall I'm
content with what I have.
Incidentally, it was regular contributor David Kilpatrick who
put me on to the Armstrong, and he also just sold me a superb
tenor mandola. DK has, I think, 2 Lowdens; one steel, one
nylon, and he's also posted comments on some groups (UKMG?
RMMGA?) about Lowdens, George Lowdens, and the current
factory derivatives of the Lowden range. DAVID!! YOU OUT
THERE??
Cheers,
Magnus
Jonathan J Quick
2003-08-28 14:45:26 UTC
Permalink
So, the upshot was that I played every Taylor in the house
and wouldn't have given you £400 for one let alone the £1400
asking price. Dull, flat and lifeless.
Interesting, as absolutely everyone who has played my Taylor 412CE has loved
the sound and the feel of it. It's probably the warmest and fullest-sounding
acoustic I've yet played, and was like it from the day I bought it (after
I'd chucked those horrible Elixir strings in the bin and fitted a decent set
of phosphor-bronze D'Addarios that is).

JJ
Don Gaston Ojeda
2023-08-01 01:21:33 UTC
Permalink
Hi all, first post here...
I still have my first guitar from about 5 years ago, an acoustic Yamaha
FG-411 solid top. However, recently I picked up a Taylor 410 from eBay.
After having had it for about 6 months I realise I much prefer the Yamaha in
terms of pretty much everything apart from looks. I like the sound and feel
of the Yamaha a whole lot more, the Taylor sounds dull and empty in
comparison. Have I gone insane? It seems strange that a ~£150 cheapo Yamaha
could appeal so much more than a ~£1200 or whatever Taylor! Anyone else had
similar situations I'd be interested to hear about them!
Cheers,
Dan
I have a Yamaha FG 411 CE MAB... Before I bought it i ask fot the ID Number and I learned and Checked a pair of cool things....
This model was made to have competition against the Martins (Its the same shape)...
In the 80s Japanese acoustic Yamahas were high quality guitars.
Until 1996 them built them guitars in Japan... But in 1997 Yamaha started to Built in Indonesia... the first year of production Yamaha Use the same components them were using in Japan. Thats Why This Guitars Has A very High Sound Quality. In Uruguay where i came from It was about 1000 usd this model. I Cant complain PLugged or Unplugged sound really nice.
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Candle Wasters
2024-02-14 11:13:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Robinson
Hi all, first post here...
I still have my first guitar from about 5 years ago, an acoustic Yamaha
FG-411 solid top. However, recently I picked up a Taylor 410 from eBay.
After having had it for about 6 months I realise I much prefer the Yamaha
in
terms of pretty much everything apart from looks. I like the sound and
feel
of the Yamaha a whole lot more, the Taylor sounds dull and empty in
comparison. Have I gone insane? It seems strange that a ~£150 cheapo
Yamaha
could appeal so much more than a ~£1200 or whatever Taylor! Anyone else
had
similar situations I'd be interested to hear about them!
I think the FG411 actually used to sell for around £400 so it's not that
cheapo a guitar. I've got a FG411C which was quite cheap when I bought it
as it was a discontinued line but I think they were going for about £450
when they were the current range. You'd still expect it to be outclassed by
a guitar costing over a grand though.
Andy
I disagree with your valuations. I paid £300 for my Yamaha FG411C BLK in or around 1992, so based on inflation alone it'd cost you £650-plus today. Due to some issues with its electronics over the years, I've tried to replace it, but nothing comes close without paying out Martin-sized cash. I'm relieved that the electronics issues have finally been resolved and I'll be using it, and loving its tone/playability/feel, until one of us expires!
Ottavio Caruso
2024-02-14 14:28:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by Candle Wasters
Post by John Robinson
Hi all, first post here...
I still have my first guitar from about 5 years ago, an acoustic Yamaha
FG-411 solid top. However, recently I picked up a Taylor 410 from eBay.
After having had it for about 6 months I realise I much prefer the Yamaha
in
terms of pretty much everything apart from looks. I like the sound and
feel
of the Yamaha a whole lot more, the Taylor sounds dull and empty in
comparison. Have I gone insane? It seems strange that a ~£150 cheapo
Yamaha
could appeal so much more than a ~£1200 or whatever Taylor! Anyone else
had
similar situations I'd be interested to hear about them!
I think the FG411 actually used to sell for around £400 so it's not that
cheapo a guitar. I've got a FG411C which was quite cheap when I bought it
as it was a discontinued line but I think they were going for about £450
when they were the current range. You'd still expect it to be outclassed by
a guitar costing over a grand though.
Andy
I disagree with your valuations. I paid £300 for my Yamaha FG411C BLK in or around 1992, so based on inflation alone it'd cost you £650-plus today. Due to some issues with its electronics over the years, I've tried to replace it, but nothing comes close without paying out Martin-sized cash. I'm relieved that the electronics issues have finally been resolved and I'll be using it, and loving its tone/playability/feel, until one of us expires!
It took you 21 years to come up with a reply.
--
Ottavio Caruso
JNugent
2024-03-06 22:57:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ottavio Caruso
Post by John Robinson
Hi all, first post here...
I still have my first guitar from about 5 years ago, an acoustic Yamaha
FG-411 solid top. However, recently I picked up a Taylor 410 from eBay.
After having had it for about 6 months I realise I much prefer the Yamaha
in
terms of pretty much everything apart from looks. I like the sound and
feel
of the Yamaha a whole lot more, the Taylor sounds dull and empty in
comparison. Have I gone insane? It seems strange that a ~£150 cheapo
Yamaha
could appeal so much more than a ~£1200 or whatever Taylor! Anyone else
had
similar situations I'd be interested to hear about them!
I think the FG411 actually used to sell for around £400 so it's not that
cheapo a guitar. I've got a FG411C which was quite cheap when I bought it
as it was a discontinued line but I think they were going for about £450
when they were the current range. You'd still expect it to be outclassed by
a guitar costing over a grand though.
Andy
I disagree with your valuations.  I paid £300 for my Yamaha FG411C BLK
in or around 1992, so based on inflation alone it'd cost you £650-plus
today.  Due to some issues with its electronics over the years, I've
tried to replace it, but nothing comes close without paying out
Martin-sized cash.  I'm relieved that the electronics issues have
finally been resolved and I'll be using it, and loving its
tone/playability/feel, until one of us expires!
It took you 21 years to come up with a reply.
It would take that long to find a mass-market Yamaha acoustic with a
half-decent sound.

William “William mark miller” Miller
2024-02-16 16:08:46 UTC
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